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Early Retirement SG

Living a good life

16/3/2018

8 Comments

 
I received 2 very interesting comments from my previous post. 
Cos I do think about these stuff. But many times, I don't formulate my thoughts around them so it doesn't appear as a post until someone comments or asks stuff. 
So I really appreciate it when readers give a comment which triggers some of my thoughts which I had thought of but never bothered to talk about.
​
... I would really be interested to hear your views about ‘what constitutes a worthy/good life’, based on your current moral worldview. Do you think that a once we reach financial freedom, is it ‘better’ to have a (I) simple life which fulfills only ourself and those we care about; or might it be ‘better’ to try to do something noble like charity or some kind of ‘noble’ job? Do you think that someone who lives a monk-like ascetic existence is less virtuous than say, someone who founded a charity to contribute to some important social causes?...
​​- Kuriko
​

... it seems that you may have run out of a purpose/pursuit of meaning in life? For most, as you have noted, the purpose may be to achieve a form of financial stability. Or to pursue financial stabiliy as a means to achieve a comfortable life for their children/parents. But u have already are financially indepedent, reached an advanced level of thinking, have little desires and expenses. Maybe it is time to pursue a new purpose? E.g. being a coach/mentor, a new hobby, or restarting a career...
​- Tony


Ok usually, I put the comment in my main post cos I feel it's like giving credit to the person to inspired the post. But if you don't like it please inform me and I'll remove it. 

So these 2 comments forced me to structure my thoughts into a post instead of leaving them all in random bits. 
The main theme behind the question is pretty much...
What is the meaning of life? And what constitutes to leading a good life?

Of course, there's not right and wrong answer, and this is pretty much in accordance to my current mental state. If someone asked me this 10 years back the answer would be extremely different. 

My most simple answer to this is, there is no meaning in life. 
The meaning in life is to live. 
That's it. 

To me, humans aren't very much different from a dog, lions, cows. We are all animals living on Earth. 
No I'm not the religious type. I've read up on many different religious ideas and scientific stuff and I've come to a certain framework of how things are. I do have some other beliefs about spiritual, fate, superstitions and stuff, but those are not the same as religious beliefs. 

Ok so back to topic. What are we here for? Well... we are here to be here. I don't think too much about that. Asking this question just goes around in circles. 
A dog, cat, deer... they just exist. Only humans think too much. 
Most animals. Just enjoy their life, or they try to enjoy their life, they work to find food, then they eat, sleep, procreate and die... that's life. 

Humans are a bit more complicated. But yet, are so similar. Humans work to find food, then eat, sleep, procreate and die. But we build so much other complicated structures upon ourselves. Societal norms, cultural norms, religious differences, racial issues...

So, no... I reject or try to reject all these "norms" cos norms are made by man. 
I try to live a good life. 
And I define a good life to be a life where I am happy, and do what I want, as long as I don't hurt or disturb someone else, I am free to do whatever I want. 

To me, there's no difference between a person whom society will consider a bum. Maybe someone who plays video games all day and lives off his family inheritance.
As compared to a doctor. 

Everyone in society would consider the bum to be useless and the doctor to be successful and a better person. But this is a label by society. 
We owe it to ourselves to live a happy life without fear of the additional artificial pressures created by society. 

The bum could be happy for his whole life. 
And the doctor could be helping people but be miserable his whole life if he doesn't like what he does.
And when they both come to the end of their lives, what would they think? 
Bum : I really enjoyed my life, shiok sia.
Doc : What a miserable life I lived. 

But... who cares? 
You see... what I think, is that we all owe it to ourselves to live a good and happy life. Cos that's what we all have here on Earth. Just around 80 years or so. On our death beds, we all answer to ourselves.
When I sit on a plane and it jerks around, I think to myself. Am I happy where I am? Cos if the plane goes down, it really doesn't matter if society thinks I'm a great man or a bum. Cos for me, I'd be thinking... am I happy with how I lived my 35 years of life. 

So this is how I think about my life. Firstly and most importantly, am I happy with it? Cos that's what we are all here for. 80 years. That's it. 

Then we go on to what should we do about it. 
Whether someone decides to help a noble cause or sits around doing nothing is all up to the individual. 
I believe what is important is, are you/we true to ourselves? 
What good is a person who is the CEO of a charity, but he doesn't really like helping people, he just likes the power he gets by sitting at the top seat?
Are we/you living in a world of lies? Do you smile at people you don't like? 
Some people thrive in such environments. They are really happy when they get promoted. 
But is this what life should be about? Is this success? By being a hypocrite and political? 

As I untie myself from societal norms, I avoid people who just say things for the sake of it. I avoid people I don't like and hang around more with people I like. And to me, this is what it means to live a good life. If I'm going to spend 80+ years on Earth, this is what I'd rather be doing. 

For me, what someone does with his life in terms of work, is irrelevant. As long as he is true to himself he is someone to be admired. 
I do feel somewhat sad for a person who needs to find recognition from external sources. Someone who must earn a certain amount of money to feel successful... someone who needs a certain level of power or reach a certain position in life, etc... 

So I don't really look at financial independence together with this. It is somewhat a different idea. 
For me, it took a certain amount of financial security before I managed to live the way I want.
For others, they may already be able to live the way they want. They may be very happy doing the job that they love so much that they look forward to going to work everyday. And they don't mind living a political life smiling at people they don't like. 
I'm fully aware that there are people who don't struggle to do such stuff. 
For me, I feel a great conflict within me when I do it. 

Ok so based on this, to answer the comments, I believe a good life is a life that someone is able to do what they want and be true to themselves.
It doesn't matter if they are freegans, bums playing video games and not contributing to society, or people who help out with charitable organizations. 
People owe it to themselves to live a happy life for the 80 years they are alive. 
Even if someone is financially free, if he/she does charity work but doesn't like it, then that person has wasted their own life. 
Cos to me, the objective of life is to live, to be happy, to simply exist. 
I reject the idea that a life is deemed wasted unless it is a life of contribution to society, regardless of the feelings of the individual. 

This doesn't mean I encourage people to be a bum. I encourage people do be true to themselves, surround themselves with people who love them and people that they love. To be happy with their lives, if they aren't happy, to do something about it. Cos in the end, you only answer to yourself. 
If the bum doesn't enjoy playing games but continues to do that, then that is also considered a waste of his life. Bumming around is only a waste if the person himself feels it is a waste. 

As for the 2nd comment about losing a purpose in life. Yes, initially this was the thought, but I came to terms that there IS no meaning in life but to enjoy it. So whatever I do now is somewhat entertainment or curiosity.  Like how I embarked upon my freegan journey. It wasn't necessary to explore that route, but I found it interesting, so I went to take a look and found that for me, that journey was very enlightening. 

Imagine a pet puppy following an owner along on the owner's business trips. Does the puppy feel any need to do anything more? The puppy makes the owner happy just by keeping the owner company. 
Or maybe the pet puppy will do some other activity. Find food to bring home, or help someone or whatever... 

So yes, I do think humans think too much about meaning and what they want to accomplish in life. Cos they have an inherent desire to find purpose. And definitely, with kids, the purpose becomes a lot more obvious, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with finding purpose. 
Cos sure as hell, it isn't easy to come to terms with "life has no meaning". 
So it's easier for people to work along the lines of "be a useful person to society".

Where do I go from here? 
I have no idea really. 
Cos my wife loves her job. It sends her overseas once or twice a month. She enjoys me going over. I don't really enjoy going over but I enjoy making her happy. If I start out some other thing with heavy commitment I won't be able to follow her along and that would mess up our current situation. 
She may not feel so happy with her job cos she might not like travelling for work without company, or our relationship may get worse cos she would not be around at home 25%-50% of the month. 

When I'm back in Singapore, I collect food and pick her up, we are both happy with the current flexibility of my schedule.
So for now... I'd prefer to keep the status quo. We are both sufficiently happy with how things are. If I start doing anything more it may shift the balance and end up in a worse off situation.
So no point fixing something that isn't broken for now. Unless things change in future. 


* Of course this is my own feelings on how I want to live my life. If you want to live it another way by all means go ahead, there's no right or wrong answer. In the end, it's not about me. It's about your own life and how you want to progress with your journey. *


​
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8 Comments
Kuriko
16/3/2018 04:25:05 pm

Dear ERSG, thank you for addressing my question so quickly and with so much clarity and depth - this is a rare and valuable gift. I am glad to know your view, and to also know that there is someone else who thinks like me. I have been struggling for many years and I used to think that someone who is doing a lot of typical 'charity' work is superior to the person who is typically considered a 'bum'. However, being in the non-profit sector for more than a decade, I realised that there are a lot of people who try to be charitable because of external validation or expectations (they want to appear good to others, regardless of whether they sincerely take pleasure from the charitable work). They are not working from their sincere heart and somehow (I still cannot find the scientific or rational language to explain this), I can 'sense' the difference between a person who does charity out of his/her 'true nature' and one who is into the work for other reasons (money, status, social admiration etc.). I also observed that the results differ.

Recently I came across this article which really showed me a different way of thinking about 'economics' (https://www.context.org/iclib/ic02/spangler/) you may enjoy this. (Hopefully you'e not perturbed by the slightly Christian references)

Referring to the concepts in this article, I see your lifestyle decision as choosing to enrich the non-monetary economy (as opposed to the financial, money-based economy). The way you've spent your life/time does not generate monetary abundance but spiritual abundance in terms of love, serenity, kindness, happiness. For example, by accommodating your wife's preference to accompany her on business travel, you are nurturing the spiritual relationship between both of you. And because she feels more fulfilled and happier when you accompany her, her energy spent on her corporate work is better, and hopefully that leads to more productivity in the financial/monetary. Another example: By choosing your time to carefully think and share your thoughts via a blog about alternatives to a good/worthy life, you are helping me and others on their own decisions for life in a positive way. I feel better and enriched and with that. Who knows, it might result in me pursuing a different career which is also slower, enriching and empowering vocation to others?

Right now my non-profit job is not really 'evil', but I struggle with it being hypocritical in terms of, it doesn't really solve the fundamental causes of the problems it claims to address. It is more like contributing to the monetary cycle (get funds to pay salaries and hopefully do some 'good' in the process), while also contributing unnecessarily to wasteful natural resource use.

Now I fully accept (concurring with your reasoning) that I do not consider the person working full time in charity/non-profit morally superior than the 'bum' (whom I see as contributing to the spiritual economy), I feel less conflicted about my future life path. Thanks for helping me.

One thing I haven't resolved emotionally is that I somehow still feel 'guilty' about my good fortune. I am almost at financial independence and I think it's due primarily to good luck (being born at a good place, good time, with good parents etc.). I somehow feel compelled to 'give back' and relieve the suffering of other less fortunate people, although I'm not clear yet in what ways (that would best suit my true nature). And some days, I even worry that I might be 'punished' with bad luck (for example struck with disaster) if I didn't try to do more 'good things' like giving back to society, even though I know it is not rational at all at the intellectual level. A bird, tree never feels guilty for their good fortune right?

Reply
ERSG link
19/3/2018 08:03:49 am

Hi Kuriko,
Many thanks for your nice words.
A very interesting last paragraph which I have thought about previously and will be used to inspire my next post and also the reason why I don't do much charitable work.

Reply
Ben
16/3/2018 11:07:39 pm

Hi ERSG,

Let me share with my side of the story.

I am one of few people who prefer to lead life on my own term. One acquaintaine observed my lifestyle and enquired on why I am not following the norms of living Singapore lifestyle and I am an oddball with such weird lifestyle. I indicated that this is my desired lifestyle.

Such comment led to him in highlighting that this is a disgraceful decision. In Singapore, car, property, status and top class are some of the desires in which the people should go after, according to their views. If one desire for the simple lifestyle, this is tanamount to a useless bum with no right to live in Singapore. Such bum should go and die for the shame he/she is in. The bum does not deserve the money the government pay to support him. He urged me to discard such mentality and return back to the normal way of life in Singapore.

I disagreed and highlighted that each individual is entitled to choose his/her lifestyle he prefer. I do not see anything wrong with such preference. He continued to criticise and chide on such approach.

Eventually, I told him that there is no point continuing with the conversation and I do not see the need to continue the friendship with him. Eventually, he warned me that I will live to regret this decision.

Since that incident, I cease to be in communication with this person.

Based on the above encounter, I feel that there is no need for the minor to follow the route of the majority. This person is self-centred and expect the minority to follow his way of life which seems to be considered by the most people.

Ben



Reply
ERSG link
19/3/2018 08:08:50 am

Hi Ben,
Thanks for reading many of my posts.
Usually when people react strongly with things that are different is cos they are afraid of it. Cos they are so invested in their own beliefs that the idea that something else which might shake their beliefs.

I used to believe that the right way was to be frugal. Why do people spend so much? Now I just don't care. There is no right way.

Reply
SGRetailTrader link
17/3/2018 05:15:45 pm

Thanks ERSG, this was a great read. Humans struggle with the search for meaning in life but perhaps the answer is right under each of our noses. And your decision to live life the way you have structured it without concern about any societal backlash. It may be interesting if you could document how your personal philosophy has evolved through the years, i.e. from ten years back leading up to now.

Reply
ERSG link
19/3/2018 08:22:01 am

Hi SGRetailTrader,
Hmm... Interesting request. I will do a post on it in the next few days.

Reply
Tony
18/3/2018 01:49:27 pm

Hi ERSG,

Thanks for the reply, this is very interesting and i understand more of your life philosophy.

However, just to add on a small part (where we may agree to disagree), i believe in a more of a "skin in the game" theory, where i feel one is truly incentized to accomplish things when there is a "need". E.g. a salesperson who works hard if he may be fired if he can't meet his sales numbers. In that sense, it would be counterproductive no not have a "need" or "urgency".

Still, i always enjoy reading your highly refreshing (and alternative) viewpoints, so do keep up with the posts :)

Best regards,
Tony

Reply
ERSG link
19/3/2018 08:16:50 am

Hi Tony,
I agree. So there is no need to disagree. Hahaha.
A desire drives people to work harder, do stuff, etc.

Desire can be seen in many ways. A desire to experience a rich lifestyle, desire to be recognized by people, acknowledged, to be seen as successful in society, etc etc.

Unfortunately/Fortunately? I gave up my desires so I don't have much incentive or urgency to do other stuff. Unless it is something interesting and quirky.
Like I had interest in freegan cos it was quirky and so I desired to understand more about it.

Reply



Leave a Reply.

    This is the link to my first post... how it all started...
    ​

    Mindset changes
    throughout the years


    How I make use of my wife

    An Interesting Email

    Author

    Male, born in 1982. 
    INTP
    Graduated with a degree majoring in Banking & Finance, Financial Adviser for a period of time resulting in in-depth knowledge of insurance products and marketing techniques of the industry.

    Inspired by MMM and ERE.

    Decided to embark on a mission to retire early in Singapore, a place where such an idea is considered impossible. As I believe that life has a lot more to offer instead of just a working career. I've decided to start a blog to note down my journey to achieve this mission and help others along the way who are willing to listen and try doing things differently from everyone else.

    I have decided to remain anonymous until I finally am able to actually retire, reason being that this idea might not gel well with the company which I am working for currently and also to avoid real life flaming from people who say that such ideas are impossible and that an individual is lazy for choosing early retirement instead of contributing to society in the form of labour.

    More about me.
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